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Layman struggles with Science
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I thought I would start this thread as a place for us dumb bunny laymen to air our possibly misconceived ideas about atmospheric science and allow our more erudite members to air their more up to date knowledge.  Wink

In my trawling for information on our wonderfull atmosphere I came across this little gem; The DRY ADIABATIC LAPSE RATE is a CONSTANT, irrespective of the water vapour content. Only when that part of the air column cools to the dew point does the lapse rate change to the WET ADIABATIC LAPSE RATE.

If the dry lapse rate doesn't change for water vapour then it will not change for CO2, both greenhouse gases.

Think about that; the lapse rate is the physical rate of temperature change up the air column. While CO2 stays at its current level of 0.0385% by volume, the water vapour can change from 0.1% to as much as 4% by volume, and up to the dew point altitude the lapse rate does not change. Why isn't the air column getting warmer with the increased greenhouse gasses?

So, what gives? To me this seems like a classic opportunity for positive feedback to heat the water surface below by the backradiation from the increasing greenhouse gas, water vapour, above.

Only, this does not happen. If the water vapour is not trapping any heat why should CO2? Anyone know of any discussion on this topic?

Another point. At standard atmosphere and pressure gas molecules in the air occupy only about 0.1% of the space utilised. Imagine a cubic meter of air, that is 1,000 litres, let's say water vapour content of 3% by volume. When the water vapour condenses to liquid water about 2.9 litres of space becomes available which will have to be filled by the adjacent gas molecules, this constitutes a major drop in air pressure. Our cubic meter of air, now fogged up with water droplets, is less dense and will rise carrying its energy content up as well.

So here is a physical/mechanical transport system moving energy upwards. When the water droplets are big enough, they will be at the temperature of their altitude as defined by the two lapse rates, and fall back to the surface as rain at a much cooler temperature. As a global temperature regulating system this seems remarkably efficient to me. CO2 is not contributing or detracting anything.

Environmentalism is based on lies and the lies reflect an agenda that regards humanity as the enemy of the Earth. - Alan Caruba
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Messages In This Thread
Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 09-23-2009, 12:28 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 10-22-2016, 07:19 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by JohnWho - 10-22-2016, 10:46 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 10-23-2016, 11:18 PM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 10-23-2016, 11:20 PM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 10-25-2016, 12:50 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 10-26-2016, 01:30 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Derek - 10-31-2016, 01:38 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 11-01-2016, 12:58 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Derek - 11-01-2016, 01:10 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Derek - 11-01-2016, 01:22 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Derek - 11-01-2016, 08:58 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 11-02-2016, 12:26 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 11-02-2016, 02:03 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 11-02-2016, 01:21 PM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Derek - 11-02-2016, 10:49 PM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 11-03-2016, 01:23 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 12-18-2016, 02:05 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Derek - 01-13-2017, 11:20 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 01-15-2017, 03:23 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 03-16-2017, 06:16 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 03-21-2017, 12:59 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by jamesbat - 03-23-2017, 06:20 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by jamesbat - 03-23-2017, 10:04 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by jamesbat - 03-23-2017, 02:31 PM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by jamesbat - 03-24-2017, 12:19 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by jamesbat - 03-24-2017, 01:40 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 03-21-2017, 10:57 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by jamesbat - 03-23-2017, 02:33 PM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 03-29-2017, 03:32 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by jamesbat - 03-29-2017, 06:46 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 03-30-2017, 06:22 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by jamesbat - 03-30-2017, 10:22 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 03-30-2017, 12:02 PM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by jamesbat - 03-31-2017, 03:56 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 03-30-2017, 11:50 PM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by jamesbat - 03-31-2017, 04:03 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by jamesbat - 03-31-2017, 06:20 PM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 03-31-2017, 10:30 AM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 04-20-2017, 12:02 PM
RE: Layman struggles with Science - by Derek - 04-20-2017, 10:43 PM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Derek - 09-23-2009, 01:03 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 09-25-2009, 06:21 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 09-25-2009, 11:36 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Mike Davis - 09-25-2009, 07:22 PM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 09-25-2009, 11:50 PM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 10-11-2009, 04:22 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Mike Davis - 10-11-2009, 07:12 PM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 10-13-2009, 05:13 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Mike Davis - 10-13-2009, 07:03 PM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 10-14-2009, 12:51 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by JohnWho - 10-14-2009, 06:26 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 10-20-2009, 11:06 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Mike Davis - 10-20-2009, 06:51 PM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 10-20-2009, 11:19 PM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 10-21-2009, 11:07 PM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 10-22-2009, 05:36 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Mike Davis - 10-22-2009, 11:26 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by JohnWho - 10-22-2009, 12:07 PM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 10-23-2009, 04:45 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 10-23-2009, 05:40 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 10-24-2009, 12:48 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 10-25-2009, 01:12 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 11-15-2009, 04:45 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Derek - 11-15-2009, 02:02 PM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Derek - 11-15-2009, 03:29 PM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 11-15-2009, 11:50 PM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 11-16-2009, 05:26 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 11-16-2009, 09:02 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Derek - 11-16-2009, 12:16 PM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 11-17-2009, 09:31 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Derek - 11-17-2009, 01:38 PM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Richard111 - 11-18-2009, 11:28 AM
Re: Layman struggles with Science - by Derek - 11-18-2009, 01:10 PM



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