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The need to promote geo-engineering to stop AGW
#41
Here is the link to Richards guest post:

Stopping Climate Change

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2009/08/17/st...te-change/
It is our attitude toward free thought and free expression that will determine our fate. There must be no limit on the range of temperate discussion, no limits on thought. No subject must be taboo. No censor must preside at our assemblies.

–William O. Douglas, U.S. Supreme Court Justice, 1952
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#42
Thanks SST,
Yikes, for goodness sakes, I have just briefly skimmed the thread......
Scary stuff, it seems many there have skimmed over the guest post and
jumped to their own conclusions of what was being proposed.

I hope they "take five minutes out" to think it over and come back again with cleared and open minds.
To be fair, "we" here have had to much the same.
The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed
(and hence clamorous to be led to safety)
by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.

H. L. Mencken.  

The hobgoblins have to be imaginary so that
"they" can offer their solutions, not THE solutions.
Reply
#43
[quote author=Derek link=topic=183.msg1361#msg1361 date=1250628836]
Thanks SST,
Yikes, for goodness sakes, I have just briefly skimmed the thread......
Scary stuff, it seems many there have skimmed over the guest post and
jumped to their own conclusions of what was being proposed.

I hope they "take five minutes out" to think it over and come back again with cleared and open minds.
To be fair, "we" here have had to much the same.

[/quote]

I have tried to get them to understand what he is suggesting,in a couple of comments at the Blog.
It is our attitude toward free thought and free expression that will determine our fate. There must be no limit on the range of temperate discussion, no limits on thought. No subject must be taboo. No censor must preside at our assemblies.

–William O. Douglas, U.S. Supreme Court Justice, 1952
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#44
I hope to get chance to do the same tomorrow night.
The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed
(and hence clamorous to be led to safety)
by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.

H. L. Mencken.  

The hobgoblins have to be imaginary so that
"they" can offer their solutions, not THE solutions.
Reply
#45
This is an article from my work place website :

http://www.ucalgary.ca/news/september200...oyalreport

Kinda annoys me (plus offensive) that they would actually post an article stating that man should stop emitting co2 or else.  But hey, that is what greenies do I guess, the doom and gloom game.  ???
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#46
From mcclane's link:

Quote:Professor John Shepherd, who chaired the Royal Society’s geoengineering study, said, “It is an unpalatable truth that unless we can succeed in greatly reducing  CO2 emissions we are headed for a very uncomfortable and challenging climate future, and geoengineering will be the only option left to limit further temperature increases.

Somehow I doubt that he really believes that,since what he believes is not subject to verification.
It is our attitude toward free thought and free expression that will determine our fate. There must be no limit on the range of temperate discussion, no limits on thought. No subject must be taboo. No censor must preside at our assemblies.

–William O. Douglas, U.S. Supreme Court Justice, 1952
Reply
#47
[quote author=sunsettommy link=topic=183.msg1595#msg1595 date=1252540436]
From mcclane's link:

Quote:Professor John Shepherd, who chaired the Royal Society’s geoengineering study, said, “It is an unpalatable truth that unless we can succeed in greatly reducing  CO2 emissions we are headed for a very uncomfortable and challenging climate future, and geoengineering will be the only option left to limit further temperature increases.

Somehow I doubt that he really believes that,since what he believes is not subject to verification.
[/quote]

Isn't that the greenie way ?  make unsubstantiated claims and hope the general public buys into it ?
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#48
This is evidence that the countries of the globe can no longer continue to fund climate research because the research is causing global warming to exist. Without the researchers there would be no evidence of global warming because it does not exist. The countries were pushed into funding research which only had a goal of finding or greating supporting evidence that promoted more research. The TIPPING point was passed and the only future course of action is to fire all of the climate researchers that are promoting restrictions of CO2. Then without the alarmists global warming will no longer be a problem.
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#49
[quote author=mcclane link=topic=183.msg1597#msg1597 date=1252594609]
[quote author=sunsettommy link=topic=183.msg1595#msg1595 date=1252540436]
From mcclane's link:

Quote:Professor John Shepherd, who chaired the Royal Society’s geoengineering study, said, “It is an unpalatable truth that unless we can succeed in greatly reducing  CO2 emissions we are headed for a very uncomfortable and challenging climate future, and geoengineering will be the only option left to limit further temperature increases.

Somehow I doubt that he really believes that,since what he believes is not subject to verification.
[/quote]

Isn't that the greenie way ?  make unsubstantiated claims and hope the general public buys into it ?
[/quote]

They do that to further their aims,dependent on the ignorance of the people,who have no idea that research must first be validated before it can gain credence.
It is our attitude toward free thought and free expression that will determine our fate. There must be no limit on the range of temperate discussion, no limits on thought. No subject must be taboo. No censor must preside at our assemblies.

–William O. Douglas, U.S. Supreme Court Justice, 1952
Reply
#50
[quote author=sunsettommy link=topic=183.msg1604#msg1604 date=1252606625]
[quote author=mcclane link=topic=183.msg1597#msg1597 date=1252594609]
[quote author=sunsettommy link=topic=183.msg1595#msg1595 date=1252540436]
From mcclane's link:

Quote:Professor John Shepherd, who chaired the Royal Society’s geoengineering study, said, “It is an unpalatable truth that unless we can succeed in greatly reducing  CO2 emissions we are headed for a very uncomfortable and challenging climate future, and geoengineering will be the only option left to limit further temperature increases.

Somehow I doubt that he really believes that,since what he believes is not subject to verification.
[/quote]

Isn't that the greenie way ?  make unsubstantiated claims and hope the general public buys into it ?
[/quote]

They do that to further their aims,dependent on the ignorance of the people,who have no idea that research must first be validated before it can gain credence.
[/quote]

sad to say, but for most CNN/BBC is all the validation they need.
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#51
Quote:sad to say, but for most CNN/BBC is all the validation they need.


That is why I called most of the people ignorant.

The information is all there if they bother to get their lazy asses off the sofa,and do a little research FOR THEMSELVES!
It is our attitude toward free thought and free expression that will determine our fate. There must be no limit on the range of temperate discussion, no limits on thought. No subject must be taboo. No censor must preside at our assemblies.

–William O. Douglas, U.S. Supreme Court Justice, 1952
Reply
#52
Sunsettommy:

You say of the public:
"The information is all there if they bother to get their lazy asses off the sofa,and do a little research FOR THEMSELVES!"

True, and it is easy to do, but few people have the time. 

There are many issues which deserve attention, but most people are busy providing the needs of their families and they do not have time to research all such issues for themselves. Hence, most people are forced to rely on the mass media to conduct the research for them.

And what do they get?  Well, do that research for yourself by spending an evening watching the BBC or CBS and it will be an unusual evening if you do not see at least one item of pro-AGW-propoganda.

Richard
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#53
[quote author=Richard S Courtney link=topic=183.msg1617#msg1617 date=1252624452]
Sunsettommy:

You say of the public:
"The information is all there if they bother to get their lazy asses off the sofa,and do a little research FOR THEMSELVES!"

True, and it is easy to do, but few people have the time. 

There are many issues which deserve attention, but most people are busy providing the needs of their families and they do not have time to research all such issues for themselves. Hence, most people are forced to rely on the mass media to conduct the research for them.

And what do they get?  Well, do that research for yourself by spending an evening watching the BBC or CBS and it will be an unusual evening if you do not see at least one item of pro-AGW-propoganda.

Richard
[/quote]

But I have a family,a job,and run forums and a blog,yet still have the time to do basic research on the climate,energy and politics.

I see a lot of people being too busy playing,to bother with research,it is not "cool" when there are computer games to play,or girls to chase,or go fishing or many other things to do in life.That is why America is slipping downward,as they spend less and less time doing actual research on matters that effect them greatly.They are too busy playing to bother with being an educated voter.

It is easy to see that the Media is distorting or even lying about the issues and yet the people continue to be placid about it as if they do not care,since they have a lot of toys to play with.They just watch the same news channel day after day,and never seek the internet to see a different angle on the issues.

That is plain mental laziness.

This is a sign of a nation falling apart,letting the rulers do what they want more and more.
It is our attitude toward free thought and free expression that will determine our fate. There must be no limit on the range of temperate discussion, no limits on thought. No subject must be taboo. No censor must preside at our assemblies.

–William O. Douglas, U.S. Supreme Court Justice, 1952
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#54
SST and Richard:
On this I am on SSTs side of the issue here in America the spare time is taken up with entertainment issues and some of the work hours are devoted to sports or other non work issues. A lot of people think they are entitled to funding for diversions from reality and that is now more important than sustenance or what one would think of as basic needs. It is the new version of keeping up with the Jonses. Research and study is boring and not as exciting as watching the wrestling or roller derby. Yes with radio and TV wanting to be the providers of information and the providers of a countries morals then we have becoome addicted to 10 second news bites for needed information.
I do not have a Television and get my news from the web. My Grandfather did not have any book but the Bible and radio or TV were not accepted items in a house. He once refused to talk to my aunt for 10 years because she had a radio in her living room when he came to visit. It was related that my other grandfather was worse and he never had a refrigerator or any electrical devices.
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#55
I don't want to start a fire  Wink

but yeah, I myself am busy with work, house, honey do list (those of you with wives you know what that is), and medical issues, but I do find some downtime and read up on the crazy claims the greenies say, plus working on campus it also helps that the library is a good and easy source to sign out books (unless recalled, I usually can keep the book for a whole semester which is 4 months !)  ;D
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#56
[quote author=mcclane link=topic=183.msg1628#msg1628 date=1252693442]
I don't want to start a fire  Wink

but yeah, I myself am busy with work, house, honey do list (those of you with wives you know what that is), and medical issues, but I do find some downtime and read up on the crazy claims the greenies say, plus working on campus it also helps that the library is a good and easy source to sign out books (unless recalled, I usually can keep the book for a whole semester which is 4 months !)  ;D
[/quote]

What you stated was understandable,it is the lack of skepticism that is causing so much trouble.

That is why I ranted a little bit,irritated at the laziness of people who do not bother to do some fact checking.

We ALL should by nature have some skepticism of claims we hear and read about in life.
It is our attitude toward free thought and free expression that will determine our fate. There must be no limit on the range of temperate discussion, no limits on thought. No subject must be taboo. No censor must preside at our assemblies.

–William O. Douglas, U.S. Supreme Court Justice, 1952
Reply
#57
[quote author=sunsettommy link=topic=183.msg1866#msg1866 date=1254599679]

We ALL should by nature have some skepticism of claims we hear and read about in life.
[/quote]

Why is "received wisdom" soooo comforting. ?
The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed
(and hence clamorous to be led to safety)
by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.

H. L. Mencken.  

The hobgoblins have to be imaginary so that
"they" can offer their solutions, not THE solutions.
Reply
#58
[quote author=Derek link=topic=183.msg1870#msg1870 date=1254601902]
[quote author=sunsettommy link=topic=183.msg1866#msg1866 date=1254599679]

We ALL should by nature have some skepticism of claims we hear and read about in life.
[/quote]

Why is "received wisdom" soooo comforting. ?
[/quote]

I would think it depends on who is pitching it.

Smile
It is our attitude toward free thought and free expression that will determine our fate. There must be no limit on the range of temperate discussion, no limits on thought. No subject must be taboo. No censor must preside at our assemblies.

–William O. Douglas, U.S. Supreme Court Justice, 1952
Reply
#59
For those here interested in Geo-Engineering, the IOP have a dedicated website for the topic.  I received this notification today:

Quote:As a researcher with an interest in the field, I'd like to bring to your
attention to the new Geoengineering page on environmentalresearchweb, which
brings you all the latest advances in research, ethics and policy in this
controversial area.

Conveniently bringing together all environmentalresearchweb's content on the
topic in one easy-to-access location, the Geoengineering community page is
already proving popular. The latest news article reports on research that
suggests that small-scale geoengineering projects will be the least risky. Damon
Matthews of Concordia University, Canada, comes to this conclusion by drawing
parallels with biological interventions such as the introduction of the cane
toad to Australia to keep cane beetle numbers in check. The original research
paper is published in the ERL Focus Issue on Geoengineering - you can access
other papers in the Focus Issue directly from the Geoengineering community page.

CLICK HERE TO VISIT GEOENGINEERING COMMUNITY PAGE
http://herald.iop.org/erwgeoengineering/.../link/3027

For more information and additional articles from environmentalresearchweb,
visit the homepage http://herald.iop.org/erwhomepage/m296/zea//link/2967.


With best wishes,

Liz Kalaugher, Editor
environmentalresearchweb.org
IOP Publishing
info@environmentalresearchweb.org
environmentalresearchweb.org

"Correlation is NOT Causation"
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#60
Questioning Climate:

Thankyou for that information, but there seems to be a significant difference between their stated position and my position.

I think the otion of reearching the geo-egineering is an option which is a useful political ploy to escape from the AGW-scare.  And I cannot foresee there ever being a need to use it.

The IOP seem to want to develop the geo-engineering for use.  However, that is their stated reason, and it is possible that they have the same motivation as myself.

I hope to God that nobody intend to research it with an intent to use it.

Regards

Richard
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